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NFPA 13R qustion for 4-story building with basement

Question asked by ktrusty5 on Nov 13, 2018
Latest reply on Nov 14, 2018 by ktrusty5

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I have a question regarding whether or not I can use NFPA 13R for an existing building being retrofitted into apartments. The reason I am not sure about using NFPA 13R is that, while the building is only 4 stories and less than 60' in height above grade, there is a basement which is entirely below grade, but it also has four apartment units, along with a fitness room, the occupant storage room, and the mechanical and electrical rooms. I have not found a definitive answer as to whether the 4-story requirement is just for the stories above grade, or total stories of residential occupancy. Any input would be appreciated!

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williamsb Nov 14, 2018 8:32 AM
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Not sure which edition of NFPA 101 you are referencing but in the 2012 edition, Section 30.3.5.2 for apartment buildings states that NFPA 13R can be used in buildings four or fewer stories "above grade plane".
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cdafd Nov 14, 2018 12:26 PM
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Ok is the answer/question??

Depending on the code or standard used, and year

Can you have apartment/ hotel rooms in a basement????

OHHH I am not an engineer, so you can discount my reply if you want, and I cannot do math.
- Click on this profile cdafd . I have no confidence. Seems foolish or stupid.
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cdafd Nov 14, 2018 12:26 PM
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A quote from a relaible source::

""""""" I guess a basement could if the rooms are provided with EEROs, which would be very difficult in an underground building--especially a multi-level underground building.

In an email discussion I had with NFPA, an NFPA 13R system can be used throughout a building, even in the non-residential portions, as long as the building is primarily residential. Thus, a hotel with no more than four stories above grade could have gift shops, meeting rooms, dining areas, etc. located in basement levels with an NFPA 13R system. However, after I posted my previous post, I looked into the underground building requirements. If the basement level(s) has a floor greater than 30 feet below grade, then it is considered an underground building and the underground portion must be sprinklered per NFPA 13.

Here's the issue with underground buildings: can an NFPA 13R system be installed in the same building that is required to have an NFPA 13 system in a portion of the building? Per NFPA the answer is maybe. If the building is utilizing a horizontal separation per IBC Section 510 that creates two separate buildings per code, then split NFPA 13/13R systems can be used--one system for the upper building (usually the NFPA 13R for dwelling or sleeping units) and an NFPA 13 system for the building below the horizontal separation. """""""""""""

OHHH I am not an engineer, so you can discount my reply if you want, and I cannot do math.
- Click on this profile cdafd . I have no confidence. Seems foolish or stupid.
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ktrusty5 Nov 14, 2018 2:37 PM
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Okay, thank you for your input. The basement is only accessible from the exterior through a stairway they are building in an existing areawell, and since the building footprint is not very large, I think the safest route is to protect the basement per NFPA 13, and the other four stories per NFPA 13R. Thank you again for your help!
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NFPA 13R qustion for 4-story building with basement

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